Fianna Fail Granny, Warmonger,Hypocrite

by CorkHurler Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:48

Who is this person called "The Queen"?

by Jim Mon Jun 30, 2008 13:17

It's the first sensible thing Mary O'Rourke has ever said.
I frankly don't care who says the blatantly obvious but I'm glad a FFer has the guts to.

Mugabe has demonstrated his utter contempt for the democratic and human rights of the Zimbwaweans. He controls a secret police apparatus, controls a strong military with modern tanks, strike jets and artillery. The people of his country are at his mercy.

Send in a team of mercenaries, plenty of ex-SAS, Delta Force and Blackwater people ready to make a quick buck, and take him out I say.

by ZANU FF Mon Jun 30, 2008 14:40

"Mugabe has demonstrated his utter contempt for the democratic and human rights of the Zimbwaweans."

Er,how will you be voting when they rerun the Lisbon Treaty referendum?

by paul o toole Mon Jun 30, 2008 15:58

Is it not funny that when someone like Mugabe is singled out for treatment theres not a word form his mouth heard in the free world we live in....
Instead you get everything you need from 'Washington', the 'white house', 'a spokesman', our reporter'. Where is what Mugabe has to say, he speaks good english.
I think Mugabe got into trouble when he started taking land back from the white colonial thieves who choose to stay behind in 1980.
I recall about two years ago RTE began running stories in the background about white British- Zimbabwean's who were turfed out of their comfortable lifestyles by Zimbabwean police, facing arrest if they diddnt leave.
Lovley ladies with the most exquisite accents and adorable children seeking shelter in Ireland-and they got it. Selfless mothers just living their lives and then this....I diddnt hear one interviewer ask if they had gotten the land handed down from their families?, did the locals give it to them?, or did the authorities bequeath this land to them in an act of generosity in response to the brutal regime of British Colonial oppression?.
Did anyone discuss what Mugabe was going to do with his oil wells once he took them back?.

by Jim Mon Jun 30, 2008 17:19

Are you seriously comparing the political situation in Europe and American with the dire situation in Zimbabwe?

Mugabe is a tyrant who has crushed all political opposition.

How can you defend this madman?

by zanu ff Mon Jun 30, 2008 17:31

Mugabe did not like the result of the election, so he ran it again and forced the people to vote his way.

Cowen did not like the result of the referendum...

by bla Mon Jun 30, 2008 20:07

now she sounds like him

by Jim Tue Jul 01, 2008 10:39

Where would the IRA be without him?

by SauceForTheGoose Tue Jul 01, 2008 12:47

"He controls a secret police apparatus, controls a strong military with modern tanks, strike jets and artillery. The people of his country are at his mercy."

So I take it you are in favour of assassinating bush too! (amongst many others)
Mugabe doesn't even have any nukes.

Sigh .... I think I must have died and gone to pat robertson Hell!!

Do shut up Mary, keep your nose out of things you cannot fix. Just get on with doing your over paid job helping to sort out the train wreck that is the Irish economy and infrastructure...Oh wait....

by Sean Tue Jul 01, 2008 23:41

Mary O'Rourke is who Mary O'Rourke is. But there is something annoyingly ad hominem and stupid about this thread. You people don't for one second believe that Mugabe should be allowed to remain in power?

Iraq was unjust. Lebanon was and is unjust, as are the other wars and interventions cooked up by Washington, London, Tel Aviv or Wall Street. But this f**ker needs to go, and deserved to get a bullet a long time ago. I'm not arguing that Tsvangirai and his fellow puppets would be any better (for instance, Sarkózy has said that he would accept nothing but a Tsvangirai government in Harare, which should set alarm bells ringing). But please, there is some substance in what "Mammy" is saying.

by paul o toole Wed Jul 02, 2008 09:55

Just pointing out hypocrites, nothing more going on here, you can all go home, nothing to see.....
I ve been accused of being a Sadam Supporter by Mary Harney and Brtie Aherne and Cowen, as have we all who protested against their illegal attack, when they had been the ones who were guilty, selling him beef to feed his military throughout the '80's thus enabeling him to carry out the atrocities he was only recently found guilty of and hanged for doing. The suggestions of any support for any dictator in this thread is pathetic and rediculous.

Sean wrote...
...'But there is something annoyingly ad hominem and stupid about this thread
You people don't for one second believe that Mugabe should be allowed to remain in power?'.....
Sean, point out where the support for Mugabe is please....otherwise.....

The deliberate ignorance of politicians is more acceptable than the 'stupidity' of those who ridicule the detractors of the 'preferred' soon to be, propped up by the west, new leader of Zimbabwe....

Simply pointing out that when the west choose to take down a leader of a country, democrat or dictator, they never let us hear what he has to say....i'll let you figure out why.
But the main point of the thread was to point out FF/PD/Green hypocracy.
Mary O'Rourke calling for assisanations when she helped facilitate genocide is to me a contradiction.....if you dont see it, you dont see it..

by Hugh Briss Wed Jul 02, 2008 19:03

Douglas Hurd and Malcolm Rifkind (remember them?) to name but two

by Hugh Briss Wed Jul 02, 2008 19:17

Sean said:
But there is something annoyingly ad hominem and stupid about this thread. You people don't for one second believe that Mugabe should be allowed to remain in power?

Actually I'd say that the situation in Zimbabwe is for Zimbabweans to sort out for themselves rather than having greedy resource hungry British War Mongerers interfereing.

Zimbabwe is rich in exploitable natural resources, a fact which may be behind the western War Mongerers desire to install Morgan Tsvangirai as the new Neo-Lib puppet.

by paul o toole Wed Jul 02, 2008 19:28

He has agreed a plan to restore the land to white 'farmers' (more like slave plantation owners), for this he gets the backing of massive power brokers from the british, US and any other government-un officially of course, thus Mugabe is the problem- taking land from the whites is akin to weakening the white power base in Zimbabwe.

by lulu Thu Jul 03, 2008 18:34

I've heard from ex-residents of Zimbabwe that it's not only white farmers that have been turfed off their land; anyone who doesn't cheer loudly enough for Mugabe can be ejected.

by Hugh Briss - Smersch Fri Jul 04, 2008 17:22

I heard from ex-Zimbabwe residents that it WAS just white farmers turfed off their (STOLEN) land. When Ireland got independance land (that was in the first place STOLEN) was returned (and paid for) to the people of ireland. Mugabe tried (however ineptly or unfairly) to do the same.

by JAMES WA LSH Sat Jul 05, 2008 19:38 jimgonewest at hotmail dot com

Hey Hugh Briss,

If you think a cruel dictator like Mugabe who enjoys an opulent lifestyle (€800/night hotel in Rome, shopping trips to Milan for his wife and her friends ) while his people starve is some sort of hero, then you must have your brains in your arse!

by Hugh Briss Sat Jul 05, 2008 21:56

Mr Walsh - I'll thank you not to put words in my mouth.

Please cite where I have ever called Mugabe a hero? Else I'll have to call you the liar that you appear to be.

One can be against rapacious foreign 'intervention' ('invasion' in Non-OrwellSpeak) and NOT be a supporter of Mr Mugabe. At least an intelligent person can. Your inability to grasp that simple fact speaks volumes

you're quite gullible when it comes to the old neo-lib propaganda. While I don't doubt Mugabe lives an opulent lifestyle, I fail to see how that necessitates his forced removal by a coalition of modern day pirates. Name me an African leader that doesn't have an opulent lifestyle, while people in their country go hungry?

The question is why the push against Mugabe and why now?

Would the amount and quality of Zimbabwean natural resources have anything to do with it? Especially when one sees who is financing the MDC.

Are you, Mr Walsh, seriously maintaing that Douglas Hurd and Malcolm Rifkind are helping finance the opposition to Mugabe in order to help improve the lives of the Zimbabwean people?

If so, I think you may benefit from a prolonged look in the mirror next time you hurl the 'moron' insult around.

by Hugh Briss Sat Jul 05, 2008 22:29

Mr James Walsh, a read of this might help you appear like you have more of a clue than you actually have . . .

http://www.unknownnews.org/d0806-30MK.html

Excerpt:

the MDC supports neo-liberal, i.e. Bush/IMF type economic policies. SO, here I am trying (with some help from Wikipedia) to make a little sense of a country that’s had a very rough time. Remember Ian Smith and a country called Rhodesia? That was Zimbabwe before it gained independence as Zimbabwe in 1980. It was the Patriotic Front (PF) — an alliance of two movements that was formed in 1976 that overthrew Smith’s white minority regime. By the way, Zimbabwe is a landlocked country with rich mineral resources — the world’s 2nd largest platinum deposits, high-quality chrome, gold (50% of Zimbabwe’s mineral exports), and some other metals. The British have mined a lot of the gold. Uranium has also been found. Perhaps there are diamonds, too.

BTW: South Africa has the largest Platinum reserves. This gives us a little hint as to who really 'owns' South Africa, dontcha think?

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2007/jun2007/safr-j15.shtml

Excerpt:
A report published by the South African Institute of Race Relations demonstrated that the living conditions for millions of South Africans have worsened since the ending of apartheid 13 years ago. Official unemployment currently stands at 26 percent, but the real figure is 41 percent—double what it was 10 years ago. Millions of workers earn less than US$150 a month, and 4 million people are living in conditions of extreme poverty, defined as less than US$1 a day.

Imagine that . . . most black South Africans were BETTER OFF (!?) under the racist Apartheid regime. Whoda thunk it?

Anglo Platinum produces the most platinum in SA.

So maybe Morgan and his MDC-posse should be called: Anglo American PLC . . . for Democratic Change

And the ANC might wanna consider: Anglo American PLC National Congress

by OurLeadersAreLizardScum Sun Jul 06, 2008 12:47

Our own lot stay in 1000euro per night accomodation while old people lie on trollies, Also, they give away our natural resources to corrupt corporate friends and use the police (paid by us) to beat us up when we protest. Is Mugabe really all that much different (in essence not degree)? Our lot would happily fix the election and crack a few heads no problem if they were sure to get in and get away with it without too much fuss afterwards. But since we are easily suckered by a few lies and promises and a few soundbites on tv and in the papers, its not really necessary.

The fact is, empire hates to lose and has a very long memory. Thats why Iran, Chavez, Cuba, North Korea, and Mugabe are blown up to be such bogeymen.

The fact is we are conned by the media and their owners on a regular basis to give our lords and masters our consent to overturn countries with things we want in them.

All this stuff directly affects us. There's the current oil / food prices. Shannon airport. And right now, dickhead willie o'dea has sent our own irish lads into Chad to be shot at and it's all caught up with the fact that the French have been monkeying about in central africa for years because there are large uranium deposits there they want to have control over. And they had their fingers in the hutsi tutsi massacre in Rwanda too. A bad lot.

Saddam Hussein: case in point. Sure he was an asshole and built a few palaces and killed a few thousand per year on average. But he also gave rights to women, built infrastructure with some of the cash, kept all the opposing warlords / religious factions quiet, and protected the historical legacy of the country. All In spite of the legacy left by the divide and conquer strategy of the British. Its always difficult to pick up the pieces after empire has been in your country. We know that fact all too well!!

But stop for a minute and look at Iraq now. >1000,000 dead (many of whom were innocents) and more every day.
and don't forget the sanctions we imposed which killed 500,000 kids which Madeline Albright thought was worth it and still kept her nice job.

if we just stick to the 1000,000 dead, and just imagine that we didn't go in (we knew well there were no WMD except the ones we left there ourselves)

it would have taken saddam 200 years to kill that many people at an average of 5000 per year
Also, those people would have less likely been innocents minding their own business or kids starving and dying from dysentry (saddam had a good health service!)
Also since saddam would only live for 50 years or so more, there is always a small chance that his successor would be a bit nicer!
Also since the infrastructure would still be intact, there would be some quality of life for many people in Iraq
Also since it was a successful secular democracy (in some respects) it might influence people to think that radical islam is not that attractive
Also since there would be peace (in an iron fisted sort of way!) there would be less terrorists recruited
(you know, the guys we are all so scared of that we dump our morals and give our consent for all manner of horrible acts)

I'm not including the waging war on Iran in my yearly average (which was empires idea, and was largely funded by empire). Nor am I including the gassing of the kurds (which was largely the fault of empire which stirred them up to rebel then left them to die without helping them as they implied they would). Saddam was the puppet of empire too you see until he got fed up of being the puppet and had his own ideas.

So it's clear, for all the hype telling us how awful saddam was, there is a serious case to be made that we should just have applied specific targeted sanctions on saddams personal wealth with some social conditions on its release (stop killing so many people!!), let weapon inspectors do their job, stop selling him arms, and otherwise leave iraq to hell alone.

In fact oil would be much cheaper today as well as a bonus!! (and you gotta see who benefited most on that score)

So let the Africans deal with their problems. Its usually our interference in their affairs which is a large part of the problems they end up with.

When the media want us to go into a country, always ask yourself "why this particular place? whats the geopolitical advantage and for whom"

I'm firmly of the opinion that when history looks back at us and sees the reality of the last century (if there is actually any reliable records), they'll be scratching their heads and wondering what the hell we were thinking and how we let all this evil stuff happen under our noses.

http://www.flagrancy.net/timeline.html

by Joe clarke - Too many to list Thu Jul 10, 2008 18:57

It is simply childish to defend Mugabe just because some objectionable people (Mary o'rourke et.al.) attack him. This is no anti-imperialist. He has hardly laid a glove on capitaliam in his tiresome decades in power. His attacks on the white population of Zim, were merely to divert attention away from the disaster befalling the country. Remember his stoking up of inter-tribal hatreds in Matebeleland in the 80's when thousands were killed by the 5th brigade of the Zim. army.

by Coolock 5 - Free the Coolock 5 Thu Jul 10, 2008 20:36

Yes there are plenty of hypocrites in Africa, Europe, USA, Far East.

What about the tyrants who are exploiting Irish people right here
right now.

Instead of giving out about tyrants in countries where the ordinary
Joe soap on here has no hope of influencing why not concentrate
on dealing with the exploited here in Ireland, Greedy landlords
renting out grubby houses, extortionate rents, FINES if late
with rent ...ring a bell...........anybody????

Yes capitalism, landlordism and keeping the ordinary Joe down
is alive and well in Coolock, Dublin